Company of Heroes: Eastern Front
Eastern Front Mod (Read-Only) => Suggestions => Topic started by: PanzerWilly on August 19, 2010, 03:57:41 AM
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Hello, I like to ask something.
Can you guys lowerd the difficulty of AI in easy. I know it sound rediculous and not practicle. But I been playing on normal and hard to practice for multiplayer gaming. However somehow, I wish easy AI are less aggressive than the current patch, because its very game intensive even in easy. I sometimes play the game to let go of my stress, but the AI on easy always make me even more stressful than the previous version and its making new player felt discourage to play on their own without assitance.
I felt the Normal difficulty and hard difficulty is alright when game training is needed. But easy are meant for beginners as an introduction of Eastern front or for those who just wanted to play for relaxation. The current AI on easy spam too quickly, especially Panzer Elite, which always gives the Soviet a hard time capturing territory. On normal I will rely on micromanagementto deal with the opponent, but I did not expected the easy is also that game intensive. :-\
I know its a bad request, but please understand that not everybody play multiplayer everyday. Imagine after you been through a hard day of work and studies, critisis by your boss or lecturer. You just want to let go of that steam by cutting down infantry. And then you discover that the infantry in game is far more annoying than the lecturers and employers who boss you around. And in the end you will knock your forehead to the desktop for being hit hard by an easy AI. :'(
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I usually only play expert, but I understand what you mean. Right now COH Normal=EF Easy and COH Hard= EF normal, etc. I think we should make a "Beginner comp" For people who first get this mod. It should be like Easy in Regular COH.
Wow you are very tense, you gotta take a vacation.
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I would agree with "PanzerWilly" the easy setting is too hard for new players.
I know i was stomped by the easy setting until i got used to the game.
Course one way around this is to have an expert AI ally in battle, they usually make the game really easy. :)
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Campaigns are the places to learn new tricks
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Campaigns are the places to learn new tricks
until there is a campaign implemented for or against the soviets, your comment is invalid.
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Well what I understand by "AI" is all the "Factions" in COH. :P
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@PanzerWilly
If they can't handle easy AI they must we worst than me :P...
Seriously talking, I know you can beat the easy AI just need to think a little different :P.
You can visit the Strategy and Tactics section, there you can ask for advice for your respective faction :P. We have a lot of players that gladly could share its knowledge :D.
Also you can go to the replay section, there lies very good replays. The last ones being from a tournament.
If neither of these options like you, there's a third option: ask a player for a match :P... if you think you haven't the skills to beat him/her, just ask him/her to play vs comps(2vs2 skirmish).
Cheers
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@PanzerWilly
If they can't handle easy AI they must we worst than me :P...
Seriously talking, I know you can beat the easy AI just need to think a little different :P.
You can visit the Strategy and Tactics section, there you can ask for advice for your respective faction :P. We have a lot of players that gladly could share its knowledge :D.
Also you can go to the replay section, there lies very good replays. The last ones being from a tournament.
If neither of these options like you, there's a third option: ask a player for a match :P... if you think you haven't the skills to beat him/her, just ask him/her to play vs comps(2vs2 skirmish).
Cheers
I got played on hard and sometimes expert usually for game practice. Just that if you give a new player to try this game out. He will said, "boy, its too tough! Better played something else." I know the increse difficulty is intended to build up skill rapidly." If you get use to the game its not much of a big deal.
There are people who are not as adapted as you guys. It take me at least four hous of three match to get my feet back up in the newer difficulty especially hard mod, it was a nightmare during my first round.
I however dislike playing co-op with another AI, cause somehow, I don't trust them for their reliability. They always make dissapointing decision compare to the enemy. And for new players, getting help from expert maybe helpful, but with an expert AI you don't even need to play, you will virtually gain nothing from an AI assitance, cause it will always defeat your opponent before you get the chance of reaching higher tier unit or planning your own offensive. Playing alone is the time you get the chance of learning while lesser enmy will annoyed you but will not overwhlme you during your learning curve.
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Some people like to relax when they play game and do not care about being good. It is the kind of people who play against easy computers.
I believe that the game should be fun for everybody.
I love what you did with the AI, but I don't see how it would harm anybody if you had the option to play against a stupid AI (the standart AI from CoH) I think a small group of people would like it and no one would get harmed or anything.
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Easy IS what it says on the tin really. If you find it challenging then the chances are you're not playing the game right...and by that what I mean is, you've not learnt to use correct basic tactics that should be like second nature sort to speak when playing this game.
We won't be changing the AI or providing another option cause this is actually part of what this mod is all about. its no different to when someone suggested (I kid you not!) we release EF mod...without the soviet faction...aka just the vanila rebalance.
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so you want a stupid/easy AI to play against so you can win even when stoned?
Just kiddin but yeah a Easy AI is needed for those EF fans who are at a low skill level and wants to learn the game, or simple just enjoy such a game. I can just imagine a scenario where a newbie player just installed EF and wants to try it out. He hosts his little skirmie game and thinks while choosing difficulty, lets start out easy to learn all this amazing new stuff. After 30-45seks he gets raped by the so called IRS (Irritating Russian Swarm) who is a tumor alike substance that grows for every second, and spreads itself around the battlefield like cancer on speed... He then feels pretty terrible about himself because he lost, and makes a user on this site posts a topic where he desperately ask's for some advice, but all the response he is meet with is "L2p f4g". He then starts to flame everyone +the mod itself before he logs off and deleates his acc
He then sits and stare into the PC monitor for 30sek, turns on his favourite tune “kalinka” and starts to fap to the national statisfaction he got from being raped by the soviet faction. After he has experienced the pleasure described above, he gives the mod another try and
Suddenly gets enlightened!! He found a solution/answer to why he got raped by a easy wehr AI as Soviets… It’s the realism that’s the problem! His beloved mother Russia has been represented the wrong way theyre not powerfull enough … He then re-activates his acc and starts topics about how terrible the realism is in the mod, he uses the argument “Soviets won the war” to justify the poor suggestions he throws at the balance experts … He then starts going into a fierce debate with a bunch of neoNazis about ww2 facts…. They battle for a couple weeks correcting each others sentences and throws wiki links at each other... after a long and useless debate the topic gets locked because it has been Offtopic for a couple months. He then gives the mod a 3rd try and wins his first game as soviets!! zomfg … But . . . . . WTF he stares into a Axis win screen for 10mins and screams, NOOES all this struggle and the germans WINS afterall somehow … nooo … he then quit computergaming moves out to a remote area converts into a Christian monk and lives a quiet life in denial to axis win screens …
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Hmmm, I guess its not easy to restructure the AI script, yeah I guess that for even the most basic battle tactics should be applied. I already get use to it after sometimes, losing the pain of attaching a unit and felt the unit's value. Since I played the Eastern Front the only conserve unit are the high tier units.
And yes, the problem existed in the AI is that they never retreat, as their system auto replace the unit they lost, the management system they use is a 3.3.2.5 train, retrain, build, movement. Its very tough to manage all a structure of 6.6.3.4 micromanagement the AI could achieve, and that is easy mode. The expert AI have an astonishing 7.7.5.4 train, retrain, rebuild and movement and 8.8.7.5 micromanagement per unit. Rediculous?!? Thats how the AI in eastern front mod pathfinding is terrifying and efficiency throughout the gameplay :o. Even the best player that beaten me could achieve 9.2.3.5 train, retrain, rebuild and movement and have 6.6.5.5 micromanagement. Expert player always win when they uses other factor such as outmenuever defending, grip hold , or base rush blizt.
AI have no pain in losing a unit, an replace casualty is uncommon, thier system is efficeint enough to replace an entire squad and thier micro is always faster then a hotkey you applied.
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???
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The point is, everyone is playing eastern front, but not everyone is s tactician or micromanagement expert. The AI hampered a lot people out there who are playing the game and felt unfair to be beaten on Easy, that's why the word Easy is used in CoH, no start from normal, hard, expert and master/tactician. I think a lot of complains about unit balance are actually suffering AI difficulty problem and they blame the balance and flame that unit too strong, its impossible to survive, that unit is too cheap and too good. They always change their subjects to multiplayer, playing with real player, and hides the truth, that they are beaten by an easy AI!!! :P Expert player normally wanted minor adjustment, I'm no expert but so far the game in multiplayer is pretty good and I never make complaints about the re balance cause i leave up to the expert to re balance the game.
But imagine a person, someone like me who have fewer game option and even fewer entertainment option, you wanted to let go and forget a stressful day. You wanted to play a game, but the all days work with lots of thinking and working, you just wanted to win without a headache, only to glue to your seat for an additional time cause the AI is manacing the field and cut off your supply line. By the time you finish, nooo 2 o'clock in the morning, I've been playing for 2 hours?!? :o But usually a good 45 minutes is all I need to win an easy AI. *LAUGH* You can try to work all day and achieve mass stress form your work and tried to play against a current easy AI. I'm sure that its very annoying for the AI WHO has no pain and cut off your supply line while taking little casualty form your attack.
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Generally campaigns at expert level are the best way to practice your tricks , however since EF doesn't have a campaign so you can try playing with hard allies and easy axis
Cuz if you play with easy axis and expert allies then it will be too easy for you ;)
BTW : The AI is not that hard , however there was a time when i played vCOH v 1.0 with all its bugs , and I tried all that possible on this earth to beat the America AI on expert , but for gods sake I couldn't :o
Now that was so damn hard , this EF AI has really got all the "Artificial Intelligence" and is fun to play with...
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I've been into this game into quite sometimes, Its no biggy for me now. Just that the mood of gaming might be varied from person to person ::) And the AI will not understand their pain over a loss of an expensive unit, they just calculate the rate of loss and replace them.
I already told you, co-op with an AI is never good, they never give you a chance to learn the game. They operate systematically to take point, resist attacks, replace squads and reach tier. And you will never be satisfy fighting along an AI cause there is no chat after that, no expereince share freindly chat, and thier score is always higher then the player. I once watch the AI win the game for me without even needing me to build anything at all. Their respond to lossing unit is painless and mathematical caculated to replace squad or casualty. Their unit lost for them is just a satistic, even if ment losing a veteran, highly value squad. Imagine losing a tiger we so hard to achive, its a hurt to morale, but fro the AI, its just lossing manpower recources and calculate the ration wheter its worth another deplyment. Easy AI in the vanilla game is far more defensive, they tend to give space to palyer to explore around aggressively, to fight and defend without being sneak up by multiple attacks and allowed the player to take less time for them to reach the tier they intended to achieve. The introduction should give the player a good impression of "hey, the game ain't that punishing" I played expert and I know the capability of the AI managing loss, cold, well mapped calculation!!! 8)
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I play by Manpower, not units and morale. Every battle I think about how much Manpower he might lose and compare it to mine, if he has less, I retreat from battle and fight another day. Thats probably why am so sneaky when I play.
Now am going to see what all theses fancy buttons over the smileys are for.
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GLow Shadow!
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M1A2 didnt come out till 1992.....
But have you ever tried the "Flare" on the mini-map? Whenever my teammate drops, or leaves, I usually find it refreshing....that way I can control what it does, and have it support me from time to time, or just have it mass somewhere, while I wear down the enemy, then have the massive AI blob clean up....AI isnt that bad to play with....its stupid blobbers that ruin the game :/
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I agree, with a 4v4 game one 1 drops the comp can take points, do annoying stuff and such. But it only works with 3v3s or 4v4s.