Company of Heroes: Eastern Front
Eastern Front Mod (Read-Only) => General Discussion => Topic started by: Mattdamon07 on March 20, 2011, 09:29:06 PM
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post ur campaign ideas here for the eastren front, it may include ostheer as well
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I don't think there's much to say in this field is there? Just... What happened.
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- Siege and battle of Sevastopol (loads of artillerie)
- Something around Stalingrad (loads of infantry)
- Summer '43 - Kursk, Orel and Prokhorovka (huuuge loads of tanks)
These are very generic ones, but sure interesting with all the new units.
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Maybe a mission on Dom Pavlova where you must resist at German assaults! 8)
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Here's the sketchy scenario for soviet campaign:
Battle for Moscow
Siege of Leningrad (Невский пятачок - Neva's spot (most-heavy fighting); Дорога жизни - Road of life (getting supplies to the besieged city under heavy artillery fire through the frozen lake; Breaking the siege)
Battle for Kiev (capitol city of Ukrainian soviet republic)
Siege of Sevastopol
Battle for Stalingrad (soviet army is nearly forced into the Volga river, only a thin stripe remains under its control, supplies and reinforcements come from across the river)
Kursk
Forcing the Dnepr river
Operation Bagration in Belorussia
Battle for Rumania
Siege of Budapest
Siege of Berlin
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A Berlin campaign. Missions:
- Crossing of the Oder river
- Seelow Heights
- Battle of Halbe
- Berlin outskirts
- Battle for the Reichstag
Fight your way onto the German capitol city.
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Does anybody know if the Ostheer are going to get their own campaign?
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Concerning "Dom Pavlova" mission,- some mapping:
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Does anybody know if the Ostheer are going to get their own campaign?
Someone of the devs, I don't remember who, said that both Soviets and Ostheer will get their own campaign.
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Hey, that's awesome. Thanks Maxi. Looks like Eastern Front will be in development for quite some time now. Not sure if that's a bad or good thing...
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Hey, that's awesome. Thanks Maxi. Looks like Eastern Front will be in development for quite some time now. Not sure if that's a bad or good thing...
See this as an opportunity for concentrating on other things :)
What you can also do is taking part in development and cook some nice maps, if you can.. ;)
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Man, i would love to make maps, even more than i would love to be able to play Company Of Heroes, but the WorldBuilder always crashes whenever i try to use it. But, hey, at least it works better than Company Of Heroes...
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here is mine for the ostheer, Operation barbossa-some battle with an eastrenfront map. then festung breslue that good map. then the last days of berlin. needs to be longer though
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Ostheer should be Operation Barabarossa. After that, some batles where they have to hold out like in Trun in ToV.
I was thinking, mapping the spot out in some first person shooter games like CoD : WaW?
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I realize, how much many of you, people, are anxious about some Ostheer campaign, but AFAIK the work on it will only be started after:
a) Ostheer faction is finished and polished (which is obvious),
b) soviet campaign is finished.
So, having no disregard for your anticipation of the Ostheer campaign and the corresponding ideas, I suggest putting a little more focus on the soviet campaign ATM.
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I was thinking, wouldn't the Ostheer have the same missions as the soviets?
Maybe you should do Ostheer battles of to Half of Stalingrad, then Soviet Missions After that.
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Makes sense - Play as the Soviet army when they are winning, and then as the Ostheer when they are winning. Granted it would be backwards, but it wouldn't be the first time in Company Of Heroes...
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I was thinking, wouldn't the Ostheer have the same missions as the soviets?
Maybe you should do Ostheer battles of to Half of Stalingrad, then Soviet Missions After that.
Makes sense - Play as the Soviet army when they are winning, and then as the Ostheer when they are winning. Granted it would be backwards, but it wouldn't be the first time in Company Of Heroes...
Ignorance (even a generic one) doesn't really make up for a history knowledge, guys. First major battle to be lost by german army was the battle for Moscow in 1941. Winter 1941-42 was the time of the first soviet offensive. That offensive pushed back the positions of the german army for 150-400 kilometers (it was a major offensive)
Don't look silly - google before posting (at least).
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Sorry, IJoe, but i have no idea what the hell you are talking about. ??? ??? ???
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Sorry, IJoe, but i have no idea what the hell you are talking about. ??? ??? ???
Mostly about Seeme's post and you agreeing with it, but never mind, keep you mind as clean as possible (oh! did I just make a calembour ?).
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for the Ostheer you could make a campaign in germany, where the Ostheer fight with a lot outdated units like panzer III and panzer II and marauder II. vs the sovjet horde
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OMG IJoe, I know that they were fighting back, but Stalingrad was to Turning point basically, so I assumed it would to be playing as Ostheer when they were doing good, and Soviets when they were crumbling.
Dude, stop being a history fanatic.
How about you start thinking about it before you post your history mumble jumble.
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OMG IJoe, I know that they were fighting back, but Stalingrad was to Turning point basically, so I assumed it would to be playing as Ostheer when they were doing good, and Soviets when they were crumbling.
Dude, stop being a history fanatic.
How about you start thinking about it before you post your history mumble jumble.
There's nothing wrong with being an educated person with a broad knowledge of history and a love for it. On the contrary.
I do not like people saying nonsensual things - true! So what? Does it make me a history fanatic? Not really.
No need to be hiding behind the curtain of presenting history (and it's not like I mentioned some detail, that is known only to scholars, - it is know to virtually anyone, who has ever seriously tried to learn about the WW2 in it's entirety) as something of no or little value, while saying things, that look strange at the least.
Basically, this isn't some softball league (or whatever you, US high school students play these days), - we discuss possible campaign script here, which is supposed to be based on history, more or less, and saying that soviets were loosing 'till the very Stalingrad battle is simply false, as I have noted.
Knowledge is power!
Cheers!
Yeah, pardon me for all this OT stuff, - it's friday, and I just came back home from a "reggae party" of a sort ;D
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i really want to play a battle in berlin as the germans
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Yeah, pardon me for all this OT stuff, - it's friday, and I just came back home from a "reggae party" of a sort
That explains everything! so you are high while posting here? not trying to be stereotypical at all ;D
I wouldent care if the campaign missions arent 100% accurate. As long as they are fun to play.
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Hey! We all get our highs and lows,- this is life, right? ;D
...Anyway, I was thinking of a Stalingrad map (Soviet campaign), where you would start forcing your way out of Volga onto the quay (1st objective), capture the Mill house (2nd objective), advance to the sgt. Pavlov's house (a.k.a. Dom Pavlova), capture it and hold it against a counter attack (a real heavy one, with artillery and coming in three waves). That would be fun (IMO), intense and somewhat historically accurate (kind o' pressing events of several moths into a one-day operation).
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I like the trun campaign. 1 map for 3 different battles. I could imagine this for Stalingrad too.
1.: Defend Stalingrad against the advancing Ostheer (but you have to retreat to the Volga)
2.: Battle at Pavlovs house or at the mill
3.: Retake Stalingrad
All on the same map. Maybe side missions like sniper ace that takes out 3 Officers and has to go cloaked trough german lines
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The battle of kursk would be a neat campaigne :D
And maybe a offensiv defensive campaigne in Finland the summer of 44 from the germans perspective ? ^^
The fanboys are going to go crazy hoping for finnish soldiers if the campaigne takes place there and it would be fun to like HELL NO *trollface* not a singel finnish soldier XD
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For Berlin itself, it definitely should be done in three parts:
1. The penetration of the suburbs, following the path of the 3rd Shock Army in its attack on Pankow and Reinickendorf (To the north of the Reichstag area). This would be standard residential house-to-house fighting.
2. The fighting in the city center. I'm a little unsure of whether the 3rd Shock Army should be played again, or if the 8th Guards Army would be better. I lean towards the 8th, if only because the fighting in the Tiergarten would be rather interesting. This would see a lot more fighting centered on large, important landmarks and buildings rather than residential housing.
3. The assault on the Reichstag area. I'd suggest that it should begin with the 3rd Shock Army's assault on the Moltke Bridge, and end with the clearing of the Konigsplatz up the entrance to the Reichstag.
Now, for the rest of the campaign. Here are some of my suggestions for battles, to provide some interesting variation throughout:
Soviet Campaign
Part 1: Defense of the Motherland
- Begins with the Battle of Leningrad, with 1-2 missions devoted to the defense of the route to the city and the city itself.
- Then moves on to Moscow herself, with 2 missions devoted for the city's defense and 1 to the immediate counterattack on December 5th.
- Here we skip to the Battle of Voronezh, with a mission devoted to the defense against the original German attack, and to a counterattack to liberate that area (Which only partially succeeds).
- Next, Stalingrad. This is already discussed in plenty of detail, so I think I don't have to talk much about it. I would suggest 2-3 missions focused upon its defense.
As the battle for Stalingrad reaches its peak at Pavlov's House, the Soviet counterattack begins.
Part 2: Reclaiming the Motherland
- As I mentioned above, the first two missions should be focused upon the Soviet encirclement of the defenders at Kalach (Part of Operation Little Saturn), and then on the defeat of Manstein's Operation Winter Storm.
- A mission devoted to the Battle of Novorossiysk, centered on the capture and defense of Malaya Zemlya.
- From here we skip ahead a bit to the Battle of Kursk. I'd suggest 3 missions devoted to this battle. The first at Ponyri, on the northern face of the salient, with heavy back and forth fighting between both sides as the Soviets attempt to push the Germans back, and the Germans try to push forward. Then we switch to the southern face, with the Defense of Syrtzevo in which the Soviets defend against the German assault, and the climactic Battle of Prokhorovka.
- After that comes the Soviet Counterattack. The first mission is for Operation Kutozov, the Soviet counterattack towards Orel. Another mission is devoted to Operation Polkovodets Rumyantsev, the southern counterattack against Kharkov and Belgorod.
- Two missions, one for the Lower Dnieper Strategic Offensive Operation, and one for the Battle of Kiev.
- One mission for the recapture of Smolensk.
- One mission for the lifting of the Siege of Leningrad.
- Three missions for the Dnieper-Carpathian offensive. The first for the Korsun Pocket (Supposedly very, very bloody and violent) the second for the assault across the Bug, and the third for the Battle and liberation of Odessa by the 8th Guards Army, attacking through a blizzard.
With Odessa free, the Ostheer in retreat on all fronts, and the Red Army poised to crush them once and for all, we turn to.......
Part 3: Assault on the Reich
- OPERATION BAGRATION. Yeah, in all caps. This is one of my favorite offensives. Let’s give it three missions. One for the assault and encirclement of Vitebsk, another for the taking of Mogilev, and finally, the liberation of Minsk.
- Next we have a mission devoted to the Battle of Riga and the ensuing encirclement of German forces in the Courland Pocket.
- 3 missions, devoted to the fighting in Hungary, especially around Budapest. The first focuses on the fighting in Pest, on the eastern side of the Danube, with heavy urban fighting. Then there's another mission for the halt of the German attempt to liberate the city. Finally, there’s the taking of Buda itself, which will be very hard due to the hilly nature of the city.
- 2 missions for the Vistula-Oder offensive. The first for the Battle of Warsaw (More bloody urban combat), the second for Zhukov’s advance to the Oder.
I'm not quite sure where to go from here, but there's a lot already. Thoughts?
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is there any ostheer suggestions?
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is there any ostheer suggestions?
No.
Why do you ask?
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In either case, soviets have priority on that ;).
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It is possible, that campaigns ideas is take a lace ealier, but i wish to try.
All Campaigns will repeat history eveants, historical battles.
1. "Dying but don't surrender." "Умираю но не сдаюсь."
Country border defence & winter counterattack.
Campaign battle group: NKVD border defence forces. (Naming can be corrected.)
History event: 132 NKVD battalion "hold the line" near the border of the country, wile main frontline RKKA korps retreating for build the defence line near Kiev. Hard bloody fighting aling to one month, including Brest Fortress defence.
42 NKVD convoy brigade in Belorussia, near Minsk city hold a bridge in 4 days, while evacuation is proceding. It's hard defence line with 15km longtitude, against motorised divition with 300 tanks.
6 NKVD divisions reforms to infantry divitions for the Moscow defence line. They are hold the main defence lane, counterattack then to 80-100km in depth of the front.
Moscow defence map for change a battle places & later transfer to the campaign:
(http://www.mr-msk.ru/netcat_files/Image/hronika_mosk_srajeniya_800.jpg)
(http://www.mr-msk.ru/netcat_files/Image/hronika_mosk_srajeniya_800.jpg)
Conditions - pure tank resources, NKVD infantry battlegroups with Molotovs availability.
2. "Behind the Volga river we have no land." Stalingrad.
NKVD stuff organise field sniper school. Experienced on border battles, NKVD officers & soldiers transfers to the hot points of the frontline to teach tallent soldiers as a snipers.
Agents got the information about "Blau" operation.
There are long time streetfighting episodes & near city hard war episodes.
Bloody Mamaevs mound, hard long defence of Pavlovs house, "Uran" operation, Operation "Circle".
For example - Pavlovs House have a basement with a soviet forvard defence line. Along those basement stuff sending food, ammo & reinforcements. With MG nests, minefields & barbed wires was helpfull for holding the line.
During Stalingrad battle, take a place tank attacks, counteroffensive, massive sniper tactics, & new version of Tank break-through army doctrine.
Battlegroup: Stalingrad front against Army group B.
Conditions: Hard defense, medium offensive difficulty.
3. "Steel offensive" Kursk
Events:
Summer–Autumn Campaign of 1943 (1 July – 31 December) include:
Kursk Strategic Defensive Operation (5–23 July 1943)
Orel-Kursk Defensive Operation (5–11 July)
Belgorod-Kursk Defensive Operation (5–23 July)
Orel Strategic Counter-offensive Operation (codenamed Operation Kutuzov) (12 July – 18 August 1943)
Volkhov-Orel Offensive Operation (12 July – 18 August)
Kromy-Orel Offensive Operation (15 July – 18 August)
Belgorod–Kharkov Counter-offensive Offensive Operation (codenamed Operation Rumyantsev) (3–23 August 1943)
Belgorod–Bogodukhov Offensive Operation (3–23 August)
Battle of Prokhorovka (12 July 1943)
Zmiyev Offensive Operation (12–23 August)
(There are lot of information ... posting later if neded.)
Campaign can be divided into 2-4-8 large scale episodes.
4. "Eastern front falls - "Operation "Bagration"
Events:
The battle - first phase: the tactical breakthrough
The first phase of Soviet deep operations, the "deep battle" envisaged breaking through the tactical zones and forward German defences. Once these tactical offensives had been successful, fresh operational reserves exploited the breakthrough and the operational depths of the enemy front using powerful mechanized and armoured formations to encircle enemy concentrations on an Army Group Scale.
Vitebsk-Orsha Offensive
Mogilev Offensive
Bobruysk Offensive
& others
Second phase: Strategic offensive against Army Group Centre
The second phase of Operation Bagration involved the entire operation's most significant single objective: the retaking of Minsk, capital of the Belorussian SSR. It would also complete the large-scale encirclement and destruction, set up by the first phase, of much of Army Group Centre.
Minsk Offensive
Polotsk Offensive
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Third phase: strategic offensive operations in the south
As German resistance had almost completely collapsed, Soviet forces were ordered to push on as far as possible beyond the original objective of Minsk, and new objectives were issued by the Stavka. This resulted in a third phase of offensive operations, which should be regarded as a further part of Operation Bagration.
Feldmarshal Walter Model, who had taken over command of Army Group Centre on 28 June when Ernst Busch was sacked, hoped to reestablish a defensive line running through Lida using what was left of Third Panzer, Fourth and Ninth Armies along with new reinforcements.
Šiauliai Offensive
Vilnius Offensive
Belostock Offensive
Lublin-Brest Offensive
Kaunas Offensive
Osovets Offensive
...
(Map for easy battle places finding.)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/44/BagrationMap2.jpg (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/44/BagrationMap2.jpg)
Conditions: Large scale, hard offensive fighting, massive tank armys applied.
It's for ideas only ...
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Topics merged
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It is possible, that campaigns ideas is take a place earlier, but i wish to try....All Campaigns will repeat history eveants, historical battles. ;D ;D ;D
Hedgehopper greetings. your campaign maps were unavailable on wiki. MS. said something about errors in the upload. What is the name of the book and publisher they were found in? maybe i can get my library to order it. I don't know cyrillic for borsht. I was fascinated by the notes on Operation Silver Fox I didn't know about the joint operation between the xxxvi Mtn Corps and the Finnish III mtn corps to take Murmansk. 8) In any case the Maps are great. A campaign scenario on the OKW's assault on the triple defence lines would be wild. from the Ostheer player's side but seems like the plans are being made for a Sov Faction campaign. :( Ah well there will be time enough later to develop mods on the EF mod. :) The maps seem to indicate a paradrop into a Sov. pocket west of Moscow. Is this a supply drop or an airbourne operation? If you take half as much care in designing your campaign as you did in crafting this post the campaign will be great! :)
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A Berlin campaign. Missions:
- Crossing of the Oder river
- Seelow Heights
- Battle of Halbe
- Berlin outskirts
- Battle for the Reichstag
Fight your way onto the German capitol city.
Sounds like CoD: World at War.....
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Ostheer campaign: operation barbarossa
soviet campaign: the counter offensive on to berlin!
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Ostheer campaign: operation barbarossa
soviet campaign: the counter offensive on to berlin!
Not quite accurate :P
New suggestion (as an alternative to Stalingrad):
Rschew (Rzhev) pocket
As the Wehrmacht progressed onto Moscow, the Soviets took heavy casualties defending their capital. But in the hard Russian winter of 1941, the German steamroller could be stopped. Now 3 German armies are standing in front of Moscows doors. You, an Army of the Kalinin Front, are up to encircle the fascists and cut their head of by surrounding them.
This mission would be great for Partizan missions, too (look at the map)
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8f/Rzhev_salient_1941-1942.JPG)
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I'm fascinated that u always think of the same campaign ideas like all other strategy games had already used.
I'm also fascinated that u think of 1941 campaigns when u know all the Ostheer stuff xD
So; My first point is a possible setting from 1942 till 1944. 3 years of war where u can search for an nice campaign story.
Basing on this frame i would think of a campaign around a special soldier or a special unit or a special battle event.
Examples for my "structure" are:
special persons -> e.g. for a real person: campaign around tiger ace Otto Carius with the big final at the battle of the bocage of the eastern front near Dünaburg (dont know english name of this town)
e.g. for a fictional person: Feldwebel Rolf Steiner basing on the story The Willing Flesh - Das geduldige Fleisch by Willi Heinrich.
special unit -> e.g. Tiger-Abteilungen or StuG-Abteilungen or Divisions like Großdeutschland and so one - a lot of stories could told by using such a frame!
special battles -> e.g. the pocket of tscherkassy or battle of budapest and so one. Such a frame would limit the campaign structure but u had a real battle event u cold narrate ;)
So. Lot of possibilities ^^ Not all the time all this "old" stories like an other campaign of the beginning of operation Barbarossa or the battle of Stalingrad. This is (in german words ;)) 0815! ^^
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I'm fascinated that u always think of the same campaign ideas like all other strategy games had already used.
yeah i think all the strategy games have the same story because there is only one story :P
try to be too creative and original and it ends up being like wtf?! its not the story that makes WWII games succesful or fail its how you portray it and the depth of the gameplay/units. and in this department we have a winner :)
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I'm fascinated that u always think of the same campaign ideas like all other strategy games had already used.
yeah i think all the strategy games have the same story because there is only one story :P
Or is it because we (well, at least some of us) only know history from computer games? Sad but true. I don't consider myself to this group, my bookshelves are full of WW2 books. So there was the idea of Rzhev pocket. I will look for some other interesting, non-mainstram battles later ;)
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I'm fascinated that u always think of the same campaign ideas like all other strategy games had already used.
yeah i think all the strategy games have the same story because there is only one story :P
Or is it because we (well, at least some of us) only know history from computer games? Sad but true. I don't consider myself to this group, my bookshelves are full of WW2 books. So there was the idea of Rzhev pocket. I will look for some other interesting, non-mainstram battles later ;)
A story has many chapters, but its still the same story ;)
Im glad I didnt learn my history from computer games too :o
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I think it'd be interesting to set the OH campaign in the Balkans or Hungary. It is far off the beaten path taken by games like Call of Duty, and would be interesting seeing Germans and Russians duke it out in foreign lands. It'd also be a good place to see foreign troops come in.
I havn't heard of the battle towards Moscow in videogames, or Leningrad for that matter. They could also be good in a campaign.
And Rommel, I hate that idea. That is exactly what made Tales of Valor lousy. If you are going to focus on a unit, it better be atleast a regiment or division.
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And Rommel, I hate that idea. That is exactly what made Tales of Valor lousy. If you are going to focus on a unit, it better be atleast a regiment or division level.
1.) Which idea xD
2.) CoH vanilla and Opposing Fronts used units, too.
In CoH vanilla u played the able company of 101st US Airborn and in OF the Kampfgruppe Lehr (perhaps a mix of all this small Kampfgruppen around Arnhem and co ;)). So i dont see a problem to build up an Ostheer campaign around a special unit.
@REDcommissar:
One note; There isnt one story ;) There is one history ;)
Otherwise we wont have so much books and memoirs about this history.
I personally prefer the idea to build up an Ostheer campaign around a special person - fictive or real. ^^
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And Rommel, I hate that idea. That is exactly what made Tales of Valor lousy. If you are going to focus on a unit, it better be atleast a regiment or division level.
1.) Which idea xD
2.) CoH vanilla and Opposing Fronts used units, too.
In CoH vanilla u played the able company of 101st US Airborn and in OF the Kampfgruppe Lehr (perhaps a mix of all this small Kampfgruppen around Arnhem and co ;)). So i dont see a problem to build up an Ostheer campaign around a specific unit
Your hero idea. Sure, there were some very epic people in the war 9Audie Murphy, Vasily Zaitsev) but I just thought hero squads or individual characters just doesn't make sense and isn't really fun. I'm all for divisions and regiments and such, but focussing on individual squads is just too small. The original campaigns and OF are what I'd want.
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Had never talk about heroes oO
A soldier is a soldier - nothing more, nothing less.
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1. The story can be told from some person's perspective, but I'd hate to play a campaign more or less based around a special unit - fxck ToV!
2. Why are you talking about ostheer, when it's not even done yet, and the soviet campaign is a priority to it? Just asking.
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@REDcommissar:
One note; There isnt one story ;) There is one history ;)
Otherwise we wont have so much books and memoirs about this history.
exactly now we're on the same page ;D
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Had never talk about heroes oO
A soldier is a soldier - nothing more, nothing less.
Well you mentioned Tiger Aces and stuff. He can proably be the story teller like the guy from the US campaign, but not actually present in-game.
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@REDcommissar:
One note; There isnt one story ;) There is one history ;)
Otherwise we wont have so much books and memoirs about this history.
exactly now we're on the same page ;D
And the best point is:
In english there are two different words for this point xD
In german we just have "Geschichte" -> "Geschichte mit Geschichten erzählen" - narrate history by stories ^^
@IJoe:
Why I'm just talking about Ostheer? Well...I became part of this dev team to design the Ostheer ^^ So this is "my baby" from the beginning till the end ;)
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One interesting perspective (if we could get voice actors) would be to have the story from a point of view of a civillian witnessing the battles and combat.
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that would be intresting
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Otto 213
I am a beginner. But i will try. Good hard campaign on the Eastern front will be great thing.
If i am capable to well study campaigh modding ... when i will be capable.
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I'm fascinated that u always think of the same campaign ideas like all other strategy games had already used.
I'm also fascinated that u think of 1941 campaigns when u know all the Ostheer stuff xD
Lord Rommel, There is a fascination with the early campaigns on the eastern front and it is not incompatible with EF. I suspect the vast majority of players are fascinated with the blitz. I also believe that many fewer players share the passion, (obsession?), that you and I have for History. I like to view each game as an allegory for the entire conflict. You start with nothing, One side takes the initiative, see saw back and forth. Decision point, turning point, on to victory. I think the choice of game pieces helps with that too; conscript to strelky to elite guards, P3<T34<P5 etc. Yes I cringed when I saw the Wrecked Panthers on the Moscow Map too: but if you suspend your disbelief a little the the game does have historical relevance.
So; My first point is a possible setting from 1942 till 1944. 3 years of war where u can search for an nice campaign story.
Basing on this frame i would think of a campaign around a special soldier or a special unit or a special battle event.
I think your notion of a 1942-1944 campaign dealing with the northern front is not only excellent but could be used for a dual Ostheer campaign featuring a Carius like figure could narrate. The campaign would highlight OKW mobile defense tactics, A Narva map could be used twice. 6-7 scenarios. The Soviet campaign would cover the same period Starting with a break_out_From_Leningrad urban battle scenario, Advance to Narva , Stalmate ... on to the Citadel. Similar narrative structure (sorry I have no access to Soviet soldier memoirs or I would suggest a model perhaps a colonel with the equivalent Soviet honors to Knights Cross with Oak Leaves. point of view would be Soviet offensive doctrinal progression. 7-8 scenarios. Perhaps 9 -10 Maps would be required. a couple of rewards units, (Tiger and ATG/76mm at least). That's my contribution to your idea.
I think a similar dual campaign could be developed based on Geographical basis. IE Smolensk-Moscow-Smolensk 6 scenarios for either side 7 maps (?). Since we are not talking about a hero narrator The Basic EF_OSteer order of battle could be used without needing Rewards units. Narration would be more like a sit-rep briefing (as in Panzer Leader I).
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Otto 213
Possible art of the first EF campaign.
1. Boarder of the country.
Concept - In the first months of the war, there are many things that interfere the command radio link to the frontline units moving, marshes, combat maneuvering, counterattack directions. Sometime, more then a half of their sabotages are successful. Nazi recon teams & sec ops units are sabotage the tails of the front.
First mission must be very difficalt. Difficalt with the officers logic & determination. (When the mission is continued, there are many reports, that confusing & can stabilise the situation.)
When first battles is burned, situation incandescence by confusion reports, hard frontline situation ...
Mission, if that possible, must consist of 2 phases.
2. Frontline is stabilised. ... but, wermaht is near the Moscow. whole phront under hard pressure.
Phase 1
Hard bloody battle of the Panphilovs defence line. Orginising defence, to face off the head on panzer corp division.
Phase 2
Late rendesvous with the Tank battalion ends with begin of the full scale counterattack.
3. Leningrad. Tragedy, blood & heroism of 2nd strike army, that get surrounded near the Meat Forest. Difficalt battle with wermaht panzer, motorised & infantry divisions, that attacked from all around.
4. Stalingrad.
Various city battles with infantry & tank nazi units. City center, Pavlovs house, Tractors factory. Massive battles with various perpose.
5. Kursk.
Phase 1. Holding the defence line from the hard panzer attack on the south flank.
Phase 2. Head on attack on the north flank.
Phase 3. 2th & 48th tank corps of the SS break the 1st & 2nd defence lines. 1st tank army already attack from the north. You must stabilise the situation & stop the concentrate strike of 2 panzer groups with the flank attack with your 1st tank corps.
Phase 4. You command the 5th guard tank army. Ahead of you is Prohorovka. You must engage the enemy from the long road marsh. Main task is still saved - destroy as many panzers as you can, & save your armour units.
5. Bagration. You are commanding officer of the 5th guard tank army, of the 3rd Belorussian front. Ahead of you Borisov, Minsk, Belostok ... & Army group center.
6. Berlin. You commanding 1st Guard tank army of the 1st Belorussian front.
Phase 1. Breakthrough the 2 defence lines. 1st near Zelov, 2nd near Munheberd.
Phase 2. Impetuosity attack suburbs & outskirts of the Berlin.
Phase 3. Attack the political center of the nazi Germany.
German conseption of the campaign - similar missions, but from the other side of the front.
ANOTHER consept of the Soviet Campaign - Battle operations of the 1st Guard Tank Brigade (4th tank brigade 1941-1942).
Commanding officer - Katukov Michail Efremovich
There are 180 tank - 25 KV, near 80 light tanks, and other is T-34 tanks.
Battle operations continious from the boarder regions, to the Berlin offense operation.
Main (not all) battle operations.
1. Mcensk-Orel
2. Moscow-Volokolamsk
3. Moscow-Lipetsk
4. Tula-Kalinin
5. Oboyang-Belgorod-Harkov
6. Obertyn-Dubno
7. Yaroslav-Samdomir
8. Varshava-Posnang
9. Gdynya
10. Berlin
High intensive, maneuverable battles, ussually makes a head on attacks & ambushes, counterattacks & infantry support operations.
What do you think?
I can collect the vital information & make the detailed consept of campaing missions, brifings, maps, (if i find it) battle orders.
What is more interesting?
There are many nazi tank ace concepts been realised, Soviet tank aces & talent commanders is not so famous ... with a regret...
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well, frankly speaking, campaign which will cover years 1941-1945 will suck. Just because there's too many things which ppl want to inculde, and campaign can't be 20 missions long. I'd rather see campaign focusing about one offensive, or operation, like Stalingrad, Kursk battle, Bargration or Berlin.
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Agreed with Cephalos. Having a narrower focus allows for more focus. Like the British taking Caen and the Panzer Elite in Operation Market Garden.
Personally, I would go for Operation Barbarossa up to the start of the Battle of Stalingrad for the Wehrmacht (ending in a somber, foreboding narration), and either the Battle of Berlin or the Seelow Heights for the Soviets.
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The only interesting campaign in the entire CoH is the first one. The rest of 'em are absolutely annoying and kind o' "soap opera"-like. Too much irrelevant crap, too little action, too many scripted stuff - BORING!
So, whatever period the dev team is gonna chose for any of their campaigns, IMO, the first american one should be taken as an example.
Soviet campaign should start with battle of Moscow - the first really big and decisive battle on the eastern front, and, in terms of numbers, the biggest one of the WW2 at the moment of its happening.
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Yeah, i agree with IJoe that the Invasion Of Normandy is the best campaign, so the Eastern Front campaigns should be modeled after that more than the others, and should ESPECIALLY have none of this direct-fire bullshit.
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Yeah, i agree with IJoe that the Invasion Of Normady is the best campaign, so the Eastern Front campaigns should be modeled after that more than the others, and should ESPECIALLY have none of this direct-fire bullshit.
Don't know, depends of the implementation, Direct Fire will shine. I think Tiger Ace hit the nail with that, however Causeway and Falaise Pocket didn't need that.
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[Just realized i misspelled 'Normandy'. :-[ So much for relying on the spell-checker. ::)]
Admittedly, the Tiger Ace campaign isn't too bad, but it's still very annoying having to use direct-fire in some parts. It's just not Company Of Heroes gameplay. :'(
I have played a few games in the past that try to combine real-time strategy with first/third-person shooting, and it NEVER works. Natural Selection 2 looks good though, but that's because it's about teamwork, and you can choose your role, but that's getting off topic...
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in the tiger ace campaign, people should be able control more than a super human tank, like on that mission where there is all that infantry dropped off by halftracks! >:(
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in the tiger ace campaign, people should be able control more than a super human tank, like on that mission where there is all that infantry dropped off by halftracks! >:(
Exactly! (Well, except for that "super human tank" part, since tanks aren't exactly humans...)
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The only interesting campaign in the entire CoH is the first one. The rest of 'em are absolutely annoying and kind o' "soap opera"-like. Too much irrelevant crap, too little action, too many scripted stuff - BORING!
Yeah, because the American campaign wasn´t a soap opera.
"WHAT, NEVER SEEN DEAD BODIES"
FLYING ANGEL JESUS CAPTAIN
EVIL OFFICER THAT WAS SO EVIL, HIS EVIL TIGER WAS PAINTED "EVIL BLACK"
You probably liked the American campaign more simply because it was longer. Admitedly, the British and PE campaigns had some pretty damn cheesy lines too ("told the general to reinforce the hill!" and "what are we fighting for now my family´s home has been bombed?" stand out in my mind right now), but they also had pretty cool lines and scenes (like the one with the artwork of the dead radio officer in hill 112, and the "you got a brain, USE IT!" which was deliciously anti-macho and very smart... and came from a GERMAN officer).
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well, frankly speaking, campaign which will cover years 1941-1945 will suck. Just because there's too many things which ppl want to inculde, and campaign can't be 20 missions long. I'd rather see campaign focusing about one offensive, or operation, like Stalingrad, Kursk battle, Bargration or Berlin.
No no. Not 20 missions. 10, or 5.
I wrote about 2 consepts.
First about historical battles consept.
Second, about historical battles of the 1st guard tank battalion.
Whats more interesting?
And ... If campaing will divide in historical years, or battles, it's make more detail possibility in missions. Player will await more campaigns about other battles or war years.
... and, campaigns must content new unusual events. Few things, more often include in every war soviet campaigns in every games. It to set smb's teeth on edge. Looks like western historicals does not biusy with that things.
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Look at soviet equipment. What we have: t-34/76/85, Is-2, Su-85/100, Isu-52, T-90, T-70. Those are tanks produced since 1943 ( t-34 since 1940), we don't have BT series, T-26, KV-1, etc. Looks like current soviet equipment is designed to fit years 1943-1945. IF devs want to make 1941 and up campaign they need to make new units. Maybe as rewards, it's up to them. What I want to say is that if campaign will be stretched along those 4 years, we may get a feeling that it's going far too fast.
@Sturmovik - you are totally wrong, if you make campaign divide in years, those battles won't get especially detailed.
Good campaign mission takes about 50 minutes. How did you guys expect to make one battle, let's say Kursk, to fit in 50 minutes, while in RL this battle took a lot more time?
Taking example from 1st vCoH campaign in Normandy - we have 12 (? not sure) misions, including most spectacular battles ( D-Day, Carentan, St-Lo), some missions are surprising ( V2 bunker infiltration), however none of them is 100% historical pure. That's why campaign can't be 100% historical accurate, because it will be boring or just hardly playable ( talking about Pershing here ;) ). All Normandy campaign takes 12 missions and focuses 2 months of fighting. Who will say that this campaign was boring? I finished it twice, because it was this awesome.
Let's think about making similiar campaign for Soviets. For example Kursk battle. 10 missions, some of them being historical batlles, like Prokhorovka, some of them being totally unrealistic but fun though, like Partisan infiltrating mission to blow bridges and railroads to slow down German advance whitout alarming strong enemy patrols. Sounds fun and challenging? And who said it's 100% historical?
To sum up:
Campaign can't be stretched in time and can't be 100% historical accurate. Just because it won't be fun to play it.
Cheers
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@Cephalos
...To cut it short, I think, you're partially wrong about... pretty much everything you've listed:
1) In 1941 soviets already had T-34/76 ZiS2, PPSh, etc.
And conscripts don't fit 1942-44 as well.
2) Campaign can be stretched in time, since it's a campaign, not some free play, meaning a lot is done by scripts (i.e. some weapons, doctrines, etc. can be a bit different from MP/inaccessible at some point/in some particular mission.
3) Missions can get just as accurate as they can, so say, some "Carentan" mission in the US campaign, doesn't really mirror the exact events, nor should it. And yeah - there are scripts, if there's some need for them!
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Is it possible to implement a armoured train in coh? Model and animation of course but code wise?
There were armoured trains in use by both sides. On german side to secure the railways and fight partisans.
In a mission for soviets a german train could be captured and used to repell a german counterattack.
Kolberg 1945 - German armoured train in action (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUTXcEdrQ10#ws)
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Of course, game adaptation in most positions is unavoidable.
One of my concept is 1 big famous strategic battle. Like Kursk or Bagration.
I am not write about that, but i still thinking. Concept must be interesting to most players ... This is not a "frontline order", it's playing interest.
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@Ijoe - conscripts will fit everywhere. They are just soliders who were recently forced to join army. This 4 rifles and men could be fixed with some scripts. or renaming them.
Ok, some of my points were partially wrong, but overall idea is the same: most of soviet units doesn't fit 1941-1942. To make gameplay in this years we would need units that EF don't have. Talking about BT series for instance here - no script can fix it for now.
Fun>historical accuracy
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@Ijoe - conscripts will fit everywhere. They are just soliders who were recently forced to join army. This 4 rifles and men could be fixed with some scripts. or renaming them.
4 rifles to 8 men is:
A) a myth;
B) would look strange, when the war (with major offensive and defensive operations performed by both sides) stepped into 1942 (actually, it's autemn-winter 1941)
Fun>historical accuracy
To some extent, but not to make it marasmatically stupid, IMO
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In a mission for soviets a german train could be captured and used to repell a german counterattack.
From faces of war? That mission is lame.
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Just as a point not all missions should be the whole HQ counter defend objective scenarios one should be soley based on a partisan movement giving a different experience like the Vierville airdrop mission in vanilla CoH where you are somewhat limited in your units and must use the full range of their abilities, to me one of the best missions in all the franchises campaigns.
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Just as a point not all missions should be the whole HQ counter defend objective scenarios one should be soley based on a partisan movement giving a different experience like the Vierville airdrop mission in vanilla CoH where you are somewhat limited in your units and must use the full range of their abilities, to me one of the best missions in all the franchises campaigns.
+1
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i think the easternfront missions should be all massive full scale battles so lots of units and strategies, with about a quarter of the missions with team AI in it
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Agree, full scale, massive ... but if that is possible - minimising the buildable units. Only the basick infantry.
That will give to the game an element of a commander care about battle technics.
Every mission can take an element or a platoon of tanks. Element of heavy, & element of a light tanks. (For example.)
Campaign maps must be a large.
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i think the easternfront missions should be all massive full scale battles so lots of units and strategies, with about a quarter of the missions with team AI in it
no, for christ sake! How many big battles do you want!? The whole phenomon of CoH is the fact that even small skirmishes look good. How many big battle do you have in vCoH campaign? After 4th "this big battle" I'd get bored with campaign like this - Make a lot of tanks and blitz those bitches...
and AI sucks.
EDIT: Talk to the devs if you don't like 4 rifles/8 men.
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Why is hard to grasp the idea that this is a computer game??
Basic conscripts will always have 4 rifles/8 men and has nothing to do with political stuff.
Remember this is a topic to suggest ideas for campaigns, not for arguing about communism.
If you want to post an article you found on internet, you should post the link, otherwise we are going to have tons of walls of meaningless text... or at least put them in Code tags.
Also, if you are going to post something, please be sure it's in english, afaik the official language on EF forum is english.
So, please go back to the topic or I'll close this.
P.S. Oh, i removed some unnecessary comments.
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If we are choose a single player campaing like a single battle operation ... a suggest to ADAPT units & in game military services to the campaign time period. Weapons, completion & other ...
Post Merge: April 24, 2011, 08:04:06 AM
Basic conscripts will always have 4 rifles/8 men and has nothing to do with political stuff.
But its looks like political anti-east ww2 historical propaganda.
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If we are choose a single player campaing like a single battle operation ... a suggest to ADAPT units & in game military services to the campaign time period. Weapons, completion & other .
It is a good Idea to start with a 43 to 44 campaign start, if any kind of historical relevance is considered vis a vis EF_1.3.1 Units. Earlier campaigns could be considered if rewards units were developed to change out anachronisms. Start building the models for those one or two must have units 38T for PE HTat, BT7M for Sov T90, etc.
Four to seven scenarios is more than enough work for a campaign. Lord Rommel's Northern front Campaign suggestion, '42 to '44 (April 19), could be done with 4 scenarios as version 1. two or three more scenarios could be added to flesh out the campaign in v2. Playable factions would need a Tiger I and AT76 for realism. Both units could be added via rewards units.
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as far as i know you don't have to add units via reward system to use them in the campaign. if you want early missions like in 41-42 you can simply give the necessary units to the player. in vCoH the doctrines and unit build options are different from the multiplayer as well.
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as far as i know you don't have to add units via reward system to use them in the campaign. if you want early missions like in 41-42 you can simply give the necessary units to the player. in vCoH the doctrines and unit build options are different from the multiplayer as well.
Although it would be nice to be able to use the early war units in MP as well.
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Bigger part of all units in EF are take me to thoughts:
1. We can not cut units from the campaign.
2. We can allow all units to take a part in the campaign.
3. Campaign will be a 1943-1944 year battles & operations.
4. Other units is phigures in some episodes.
What all of you says on that?