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Balance Discussion / Re: Panzerfusiliers
« on: July 14, 2013, 10:49:57 AM »QuoteMaybe the easiest thing to try first to address this problem would be to give us the possibility of choosing to go either T2 or T3 immediately after T1 or even complete liberty of our choices for the first three tiers with modified fuel values to control what comes out and when.No, it would make the Ostheer to imbalanced.QuoteIn my opinion, T3 in its current form and unit composition is not attractive option because of the timing of when first T3 unit comes out. It is usually to late to shock your opponent with such units and what they offer firepower wise is decently covered by T2 units and of course T3 is completely inadequate to plan your late game force. So waiting for T4 seems like an obvious choice at the moment.
If you played against a human player you would find this is not the case at all, getting an early panzerwerfer can have a huge impact on your opponents early to mid game. Not to mention that you can get a marderII out just about the same time as a T90/SU76 and in a fair fight the marderII will beat the SU-76 and the T90 stands no chance.QuoteIn any case, full freedom of choosing T1, T2, T3 would allow for some innovative tactics and OH forces. For example, I have been trying out Sturmpioneers as combat units (with those T1 cars in support, holding out for Jagers), with this, holding out for Panzerfusiliers would be possible. This would allow us to play a risky yet aggressive strategy focused on getting fast light armor out supported by PFs.
That strategy would never work against a human.
To answer you in reverse order...
Well, to tell you the truth, I only experimented with this tactic to see how a few things work, how sturmpios fare in combat, find use for other types of infantry rather than Landsers (+PzJ) as well as bring armor up as soon as possible. I know that in the current state of the game with OH being forced to build T1 and T2 first strategy would not work. Not only that, it is absolutely unnecessary as you have access to T1 and T2 units whether you want it or not so you do not save fuel anyway.
With an option to go straight to T3 (smth like extreme PE building choice flexibility), you could transition towards panzerfusiliers more quickly, it is what, 35 fuel now. Besides, what works is more or less a matter of balance and time, just like various pioneer/engineer strategies that worked from time to time in vCoH before being nerfed or countered by different tactics. I remember it still worked against the Brits in the last patch (Pios to Grenadiers to Halftracks and Paks).
Your second point, you probably know better, I can't play against other people right now until I sort out the graphics stuttering problems. However, I've read through this thread and I see that most people agree with T4 being a better choice than T3 especially if you take into account the modernization delays and fuel costs.
Regarding imbalance, this could be easily solved with tinkering with fuel costs for modernization. I think that only problem for Soviets would be to guess what comes out next.