Waffen SS on the Eastern Front

[Ricardo]

Dear PLayers, Develppers,

I know that we have to be political corrects but how can we talk about the Eastern Front without adding the Waffen SS units ?

If we watch carefully the bloody conflict on the Eastern Front the Waffen SS played a major part in the different battles: Kharkov, Koursk, Tcherkassy, etc

I just want you to think about a solution that would be acceptable for everybody in terms of trespect of the history and units that would not offense poeple or victims.

I would alos like to ask you whethe it would be possible to provide camo uniforms to German troops ?

Thank you in advance for your answer or time taken to read me.

PS Great job with this mod !!! 

[Rokossovski]

Is the Panzerelite not SS ?

[Saavedra]

I just want you to think about a solution that would be acceptable for everybody in terms of trespect of the history and units that would not offense poeple or victims.

Tell anyone who complains about them to fuck off. The Soviets were not much better than them, morally speaking.



And no, Panzer Elite are ad-hoc units formed with a bit of every arm (infantry, artillery, armor).

[Rokossovski]

First they have SS ranks and second ist is not based on the 2.SS Panzerkorps ?

[Gerrit 'Lord Rommel' G.]

Why do we need the SS?? I mean you just need names for the units and the ranks but for the rest is enough space to work without the ss names and plz remember that when EF will use SS-names and ranks u will kick out all the german mod players because here ss is still forbidden.

[CommissarGears]

Im not a Politician, so dont tell me whats politically correct. SS was on the Eastern Front.  They shouldnt be in the game because a they did bad things?

Maybe you should quit playing CoH, War is a bad thing.

[Gerrit 'Lord Rommel' G.]

Hey. I'm a german and i had nothing against SS-names but you should have in mind that the SS will make problems.

First i think you dont need the SS when u just search for unit names and second in germany it is forbidden to play computergames with SS and other "criminal war institutions" so that when EF would use the SS german players would do illagal things when they play this mod
( okay thats not for everyone a problem ( not for me xD ) but there are gamers who had problems with this!!!! ).

So plz respect this and think about it Germany is a state which had to handle with its own history till today.

When u can explain why SS should be part of the game thn i will not say anything more against it.
BUT just saying "SS was on eastern front" is bull shit That is not a real hitting argument FOR the SS because SS was although at the western front and u see that CoH works well without SS ( The Panzerlite is perhaps the SS but this faction work quiet well with its "fictional name" ).

[WartyX]

The SS are in CoH already. Ever played the campaign?

[Dominic 'Dragon' Cassidy]

And who said the SS weren't going to be included or represented in Eastern Front?...

The Ostheer will be a historical image of the Axis forces that fought against the Soviets there - we will include what existed and what works in a balance/gameplay sense.

Please don't jump to inclusions on what we are going to or not going to include.

kick out all the german mod players because here ss is still forbidden.

I don't live in Germany and I like everyone else know that isn't true.
German law forbids the active support of Nazi related imagery, NOT the presentation and use of images for historical and educational purposes.
We quite clearly don't support Nazi doctrine and do not plan on using the Nazi historical symbolism to support Nazism.

I really don't like it when Germans use that argument, it's false, and history should not be hidden simply because you don't like its contents - and YOUR law supports me.

[Ricardo]

Dear All,

I understand your remarks and comments. This post aimed at creating the debate about the arrival of the Waffen SS.

Now as mentioned in the comments if it is forbidden in Germany or and could make people sad see SS so let's drop the idea...

Pe is the Waffen SS according to me. But maybe - as mentioned in opening post I wrote - could the developpers of Eastern Front think about the camo uniforms typically wore by the waffen SS. The asset is that everybody would recognize them and we would not have to mention clearly who they are. Not a good idea ?

In of the doctrine maybe could you add an option like arrival of 2d Panzerkoprs or SPzAbtailung (whatever) ? 

Whatever you do again GREAT JOB men 

[Saavedra]

Now as mentioned in the comments if it is forbidden in Germany or and could make people sad

That´s just stupid.

Pe is the Waffen SS according to me.

According to you, sure, but in the game they are not. They are kampfgruppes, battalions formed by the amalgamation of different units.

[Gerrit 'Lord Rommel' G.]

kick out all the german mod players because here ss is still forbidden.

I don't live in Germany and I like everyone else know that isn't true.
German law forbids the active support of Nazi related imagery, NOT the presentation and use of images for historical and educational purposes.
We quite clearly don't support Nazi doctrine and do not plan on using the Nazi historical symbolism to support Nazism.

I really don't like it when Germans use that argument, it's false, and history should not be hidden simply because you don't like its contents - and YOUR law supports me.

and history should not be hidden simply because you don't like its contents: I work a lot with the history of my land and so i wont hind behind history 

About your argument of german law:
Thats not completely right.
I have nothing against SS but i have
although to respect german law, my law.
Here in german it is allowed to show nazi symboles
when u need for historical education, for art and
for information. PC-Games does not fit in this three
categories and so german law said that it is forbidden
to publish and use "nazi symbols" on german servers,
forums, ect. and it is although forbidden to use this
symbols.

I informed me about it because as historian i work
a lot with this symbols and signs and so i was interested
what is allowed and what is not allowed

In End i have nothing against using the Name "Waffen-SS" and so one BUT i think it would be a good idea to think about it if a mod could live without this. Just thinking. I mean your NKVD conscripts are close to this problem and u decided to call them NKVD conscripts. Thats okay. I respect this but i think you devs had discuss this before you named them NKVD and so i want that you devs discuss this, not more.

Thank you 

[Pauly3]

i agree with rommel about the german law thing
and i personally (i am german)
wouldnt feel comfortable playing the SS
it works just fine with the Panzerelite and the KCH
so why include the real SS (with Names and symbols and stuff)

[maxi1991]

i agree with rommel about the german law thing
and i personally (i am german)
wouldnt feel comfortable playing the SS
it works just fine with the Panzerelite and the KCH
so why include the real SS (with Names and symbols and stuff)

Why wouldn't you feel comfortable playing the Waffel SS?
I mean Soviets have their NKVD and there is a difference between normal SS and Waffen SS.

[HyperSniper999]

There's a difference between the Waffen SS and "Camp Guard and Nazi politicians' Bodyguard" SS. Waffen were battlefield troops, they were a branch of the SS, sure, but they certainly didn't work at Auschwitz or Treblinka.